devo's volleyball – Australian volleyball: news and views

Good Neighbour underway

Posted by devo on November 27, 2009

The Good Neighbour tournament begins in Canberra tonight. You can follow the results by heading to Volleyball ACT and clicking on the draw/results tab in the left side column.

56 Responses to “Good Neighbour underway”

  1. Michael said

    AIS Blue 2-0 Def AIS WHT 2-1, Canberra 2-1
    Heidelburg 1-0 Def AIS W 3-0
    Canberra 0-1 AIS BLU 1-2
    AIS White 0-2 AIS BLU 1-2, L HEI 0-3

  2. Robbo said

    So far today i see these results for the Honours Men:
    Sydney Uni Drew With USP Fiji 2-2: 15/25, 26/28, 25/15, 16/6
    Heat def Heidelberg 2-1: 24/26, 22/25, 25/15
    H Dragons def USP Fiji 2-1: 25/22, 25/14, 18/23
    AIS White def Sydney Uni 2-1: 25/19, 21/25, 25/13
    AIS Blue def H Dragons 3-0: 25/22, 25/21, 25/10
    Heat def USP Fiji 2-1: 25/15, 21/25, 25/21
    Heidelberg def Sydney Uni 2-1: 24/26, 25/19, 25/22

    then Womens Honours:
    Cbrra Fiji def Heat 3-0: 23/15, 25/19, 25/13
    Syd North def USP Fiji 3-0: 25/14, 25/15, 25/12
    Sydney Uni def Sparta Auc 2-1: 25/23, 25/22, 18/25
    Syd North def Heat 2-1: 22/25, 25/20, 22/16
    Cbrra Fiji def Sparta Auc 2-1: 23/25, 25/18, 20/15
    Sydney Uni def USP Fiji 2-1: 25/14, 25/23, 11/15
    Cbrra Fiji def USP Fiji 2-1: 25/18, 25/20, 16/25
    Sparta Auc def Heat 2-1: 17/25, 25/21, 25/18
    Syd North def Sydney Uni 2-1: 19/25, 25/22, 25/11

  3. Michael said

    Heidelberg vs. AIS in grand final where’s robbo when you need a webcast?

    • Robbo said

      haha. i’ll be there if you fly me over

    • Sally B said

      From someone who did the lines on this game (and may i say a splendid job) – It was an awesome display of volleyball from both teams.

      The set score did not reflect the standard of the game – It was one that should not have been missed. I guess you could always ask the AIS to post some of the footage – It would be great for the volleyball fraternity to witness the athleticism of our junior players as well as the finer points of setting as shown by Matt Young….

      We have some really great talent in the mens AIS program ….These boys will be hard to beat at the AVL finals on the weekend – Unless some of them are aligned with the other clubs – that might then be a different story…

      • Karl said

        Agreed, footage should be made available. I think Michael had his camera rolling, so that could be an option. In the meantime, here are some photos from Heidelberg’s side of the net for those interested. They are a mixture of the round robin game and the gold medal game between Heidelberg and AIS Blue.

        Good Neighbour 2009
  4. Player said

    AIS win the final 3 – 0 in what was their best game of the weekend by far

  5. Joe said

    How did AIS White compare to the AIS AVL team? Was it the AVL starting line or id the AIS split their AVL team between white and blue? Also where does this place Heidelberg in terms of best club teams in Aust? Top three with Lofty and Pirates?

    • Whosin said

      why is it that Lofty are one of the best teams??
      I thought Norwood were in SA? They used to play AVL until they no longer held onto the licence from the AVF?

      • Joe said


      • Murph said

        Norwood have shown over the past 2 years to have been the best league men’s team in SA.

        • sa volleyball player said

          The teams Norwood fielded over the last 2 years would beat any club team in Australia id reckon. They might make less noise than Lofty, but the standard of their play is far superior. Too bad there isnt a simple Aussie clubs champions weekend, with purely club sides (not AVL style composite) participating.

    • Troy M said

      from what I recall, the only starter from the AVL team in AIS white was the libero (Tyrrell) and they had a couple of the benchies from the AVL team also (the middle – Jordan – can’t remember his last name).

    • Graeme said

      Pirates is a state team not a club team

  6. Athlete said

    AIS white team consisted of only 2 players from the AVL side and the rest were either reserves or young players from around australia.
    The AIS blue team had all of the AVL starters in it.

  7. Joe said

    Ah ok, sorry was reading the results backwards … so it was Blue that won overall, cheers.

    Regarding Heidelberg’s standing in Aus volleyball right now based on weekend results? Would be interesting to get an AIS perspective on that one given they have played Pirates and Heidelberg.

  8. Michael said

    I do have footage but wouldnt know where to upload it.

  9. Joe said

    So to get to the crux of this intial question, where would Heidelberg rank amongst Australian club teams, or is it impossible to tell due to so many state champions being no shows at Good Neighbour.

  10. Sa Volleyball Player said

    Impossible to tell.

  11. Robbo said

    Too hard to do without a club championship. It would be a great event to have, but very hard to organise i would say.

    • Joe said

      This is what should exist rather than AVL. State champions from VIC, SA, WA, QLD, ACT, NSW qualify for a series of tournaments held in conjunction with Warrnambool, Reconstituted SA Open, and two other tournaments (Sydney and Melbourne), with the finals held at Good Neighbour. Four tournaments to be held through the year (w’bool and SA open to be on usual dates, Sydney to be before state leagues kick off, Melbourne to be on an agreed weekend mid-state league season) rather than all at once … no longer an issue regarding team preparation as the clubs would be in regular training.

      Finals at Good Neighbour would be seeded from 1-6 based on results at four tournament rounds, with quarter finals for bottom four teams on Friday, semi finals on the Saturday for winners of q/f’s and top two teams, finals on the Sunday. Bottom two teams are given direct entry into Good Neighbour tournament so they haven’t gone to Canberra for one game.

      Funding to come from an increased fee to enter state league top division, $500 per team, as well as existing prize money in that division going into the competition pool rather than to the clubs. My guess is that this gives a budget of $40,000. Overall should offset most of the cost … clearly most of it would be directed to WA team flights … with teams responsible for obtaining sponsorship for whatever balance remains (or hopefully the reduced cost of competitions would see the AVF pump some money in, but who knows).

      On top, bring back national seniors!

      • Whosin said

        wow. i’m impressed Joe, something constructive!
        And it also sounds quite good also. Nice one.

      • Ezra said

        Hey Joe, Brisbane Volleyball Club are planning on entering SA Open and also going to Good Neighbour… club champions this year… A mens champs 2 years in a row now and we have 6/7 players in the QAS Pirates team…. see you there?

      • Toddy said

        Although that sounds pretty great, thee are a couple of reasons why that probably wont work, at least that I can think of.

        First it means tat state associations have to take control of avl and that will mean all aspects of it as they will have the money and the control from year to year.

        Also, it would open the door to state league teams becoming undesireable to strong players unless they are the championship team and would lead to one club retaining all strong players. While ome people might not see this as an issue, it makes it more difficult to develop players and then keep them in your club if they do become an athlete who desires to play in that next level up.

        Lastly it would mean that there is an expectation of all players in those club teams to have the desire to travel to thee other competitions to compete, otherwise selecting the first placed team in each state wouldnt be of any benefit.

        I think this would be a good idea for a secondary competition. From memory there was talk about this a couple of years ago when avl clubs and state associations met with the avf for that review. I think it would be great to create a national club championship division at good neighbour or something of that nature.

        • Joe said

          All fair points, but I would counter with the following.

          State associations wouldn’t be taking control of this competition, they would merely facilitate it by finding court space at tournaments (and on that point the association running the tournament would have more to do than the state association if it was a regional associations running it, eg W’bool). The AVF would still have overall responsibility for the provision of officials ( though I do expect they would farm this out to the state referee bodies), results maintenance, publicity etc.

          Regarding the strong club concern, you see this already in most states … Heidelberg and/or Falcons have dominated Victoria for the past 25 years (with one or two other clubs popping their head up occasionally), Ezra comments above that half of the QAS AVL team is from one club, Norwood consists of elite players in SA … it just happens that way. The best run clubs with the best coaches get the best players, both through development and free agency. Look at other sports also, Rangers and Celtics, Barca and Real, Chelsea, ManU and Arsenal (sorry Liverpool fans, you guys don’t count any more), LA Lakers … It is critical that this plan be coupled with a national seniors competition though to provide players not from the champion club with opportunities to play at a higher level than state league.

          Regarding the desire to travel, I havr to say that one is a stretch. Marketed properly, participation in this competition is the reward for winning, and in my years involved with the sport I can’t imagine too many players turning down the chance to play in a competition like this. Quality players have turned down playing in AVL because it is an expensive, meaningless waste of time, but I think the chance to prove that your club is the best club in Australia holds far more appeal and would keep players engaged. The fact that the competition (which I would like called the Australian Volleyball Champions League!) would largely be funded by the state leagues rather than the players participating, and would be held at intervals during the year rather than requiring a large out of state league season commitment would also assist to keep players engaged. The overriding reason though is that chance to represent YOUR club, not some artificial hybrid, on the national scene.

          Definitely agree this should be a secondary competition, though only just. using soccer as the analogy, National Seniors is the World Cup, this comp is the Champions League.

          • Robbo said

            “The overriding reason though is that chance to represent YOUR club, not some artificial hybrid, on the national scene”
            This is definitely something i agree with! I’m not how others would feel, and i would actually love to hear their thoughts, but with a team like Uni Blues, i can’t see guys from Falcons (although there were none this year) or Heidelberg or Yarra having the same desire and feeling playing for Blues as opposed to playing for their own club.

            The Football Champions League is a good analogy to use. but to compare us in a player skill view just doesn’t work. This in an amatuer competition and we dont have billionaires backing the clubs ;)

          • Troy M said

            I am pretty sure that most, if not all of the teams in honours in NSW would refuse to pay an extra 25% on top of their state league entry to cover a WA team flying all over the country – especially when 7 of the 8 teams in SVL honours will not even be eligible to compete in the competition

            • Joe said

              Being my baby it is my role to defend the model I guess, so here goes :)

              It is about selling the perception, but I don’t see the fee being there as one to fly the WA champion around. It is there to enable the competition to exist. Sure in practice the WA team will get more out than they contribute, but don’t think of it as a subsidy, think of it as the cost of being able to challenge a team from WA that would otherwise not exist.

              The cheaper alternative of course is to cut WA out and include the Tasmanian champions or the Tasmanian State Team instead (as I think you need six teams for the comp to be viable), but history suggests that would weaken the competition plus it is harder to make the claim that the winner is without dispute the best club team in the land. For the credibility of the competition I think it is important that the WA Champion gets to play and for that to occur the other states need to subsidise them.

              Regarding 7 teams paying when not eligible to play, keep in mind that at the start of the season all teams in the SVL are eligible … they are all playing for a spot in the AVCL! It is like any competition … if you win you get the reward, if you don’t you lose your money. I would prefer that the cost is shared over all teams vying for the opportunity to play than for the champion team to be faced with the challenge of paying to play when this should be seen as a reward.

              Also with the cost, we are talking about $65 per season per player max ($65 * 8 = just over $500) … it isn’t a significant amount.

              Now is my preference that the cost came out of sponsorship or out of AVF membership fees … of course … but we have to be realists. At the start the funding is likely to have to come from participants, and then once the competition is established the AVF could look for sponsorship.

              Sounds like a poll question to me Troy (hint hint Devo – would you as a state league player pay $65 on top of what you already pay for the chance to play in the AVCL for free the following year if your club won).

            • Troy M said

              I think it sounds good in theory, and agree that if the winning team was rewarded, rather than burdened with cost would make it more likely to happen… but it relies on a pretty balanced competition and there are teams that have little to no chance of winning the comp so they probably wouldn’t want to pay. Perhaps if teams had the option of entering in this (eg 5 teams might decide they want to pay – if one of them wins they split the money, of one of the teams that didn’t pay wins, then the money is returned to the 5 teams). This still leaves the problem that if a team wins who didn’t pay, they will then have to find the money to enter the competition – but nevertheless I think makes it fairer as it is no longer a compulsory tax – rather a voluntary gamble.

              • Joe said

                If it is voluntary Troy it won’t happen … thebase level of funding required to run the competition is such that if you make it voluntary the fee would likely be $1500 per team instead of $500, and so the risk/reward aspect becomes less tantalising.

                As an aside, I can’t think of anything more demoralising than entering a competition with no expectation that I have a chance of winning … have to winder what those teams are doing there in the first place!

                • Toddy said

                  “I can’t think of anything more demoralising than entering a competition with no expectation that I have a chance of winning ”

                  Unfortunately that is the reality of the sport. There are teams in NSW that enter to give their players the opportunity to compete against stronger teams, without whom the competition would fold (this nearly happened with our womens honours division this year).

                  I think this is a good idea in theory, but I think it would be better done as an additional division in an existing competition SA Open, Vic Open, Good Neighbour etc. Then it could be simply that the entry fee is covered, and the state league “equalisation” would be pretty minimal. And the location could change each year to a different competition to try to make the travel costs fairer. I’m sure that each state has an appropriate tournament that could be utilised.

          • edbinnie said

            Joe, I agree that people will get behind their own club more than an alternate team – UTS Sydney Uni or Uni Blues – but the other AVL teams are state teams. If you aren’t going to get behind your state, then maybe not your country … you’re probably not going to get behind your club either.

            In terms of travel, there are plenty of people that can’t travel, for whatever reason.
            I regularly had players that would only commit to state league, but couldn’t play preliminary or post season tournaments. Reasons vary from having to take care of kids, needing to work (not everyone is a 9 to 5, 5 day a week employee), exams, assignments, not wanting to be away from family (or not being allowed away by the missus).

            State league is 1 game a week, and whatever training commitments your club has. Tournaments (especially away tournaments) are 3 day events, for 24hrs a day. So no matter how much you want to put the best players in the best teams in the best competition you are going to have some sort of short fall in terms of availability.

      • edbinnie said

        I’m all for more competitions bragging rights etc.
        just looking through the model how about this suggestion.

        the AVF charges every member an extra $5 and we have a real National League, funded by the AVF, administered by the states, and free for players. Players must be registered with the AVF prior to tryouts.

        Can’t wait to see a few people go spare at this idea.
        For the same reasons, each state league will cellar dwellers complaining that this is a tax on all to benefit the wealthier and better talented teams (it may be through better organisation, or it may be that some of the bottom teams are actually well organised, and someone has to come last).

        I know that $65 doesn’t seem like much, but would you pay $66 dollars for your $1 donut so that the best donut eater can have a 5 course meal of deluxe donuts? (ok maybe my illustration shouldn’t use donuts, but I’m at work and really want a donut).

  12. Michael said

    Heidelberg is the best club team in the country bar none :)

    • Joe said

      Says you. :) Shame there is no proof, but at least you guys did go to the tournament I guess.

    • Dinosaur said

      If you are using the 12 sub rule that Vic State league used this year(and can keep George on the court by utilising his sublime touch and selection in the Back row) then I would say yes. Otherwise, I think you are in the mix.

      Bit too arrogant for my liking to come out and blatantly declare yourself. You got knocked down pretty quickly if you acted like that where I grew up and learnt the trade!

      • Happy said

        Pretty sure michael’s comment was made tongue-in-cheek hence the smilie face…

        in any case, I don’t even think george is the best setter on that team and they will probably do better with the 6 sub rule in place next year…but thats just me

        • Rog said

          Won the pre-season tournament
          13:1 in the State league competition
          Won the Final 3:0
          6:0 in the Good Neighbour Tournament
          Lost to AIS team in the final which included a few Aussie representatives
          I don’t know about you guys but thats a pretty good resume for the year. New system, new players, new coach….shall I go on???? I’m sure if the other teams, whoever they might be,came to the Good Neighbour tournament they wpuld have a hard time beating Heidelberg….but thank you for your negative comment… :) Just wanted to say what a year it has been and I am very proud and honoured to wear Heidelberg jersey!!!!!

  13. Rog said

    6:0 in qualifying rounds……

  14. roy said

    i can say that usc lion in sa would be up there if all the aussie players were playing. no use bragging unless there is a competition to prove it!!!!!

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